Jump to content

Bigger Brake options for 987.2S?


Liongolfer

Recommended Posts

Have read a few threads on this but looking for updated long term use feedback as well.

I'm thinking of upgrading the stock brakes on my 987.2S. What options are available? I'm on the BBS SR rims as well so I'll need to figure if the rims can take the bigger disc and caliper configuration.

Stock brakes are definitely not bad but for the occasional E braking, I do find them a tad soft so something firmer and a tad quicker to stop will give a confident boost.

I don;t track.

Thanks in advance

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Liongolfer said:

Have read a few threads on this but looking for updated long term use feedback as well.

I'm thinking of upgrading the stock brakes on my 987.2S. What options are available? I'm on the BBS SR rims as well so I'll need to figure if the rims can take the bigger disc and caliper configuration.

Stock brakes are definitely not bad but for the occasional E braking, I do find them a tad soft so something firmer and a tad quicker to stop will give a confident boost.

I don;t track.

Thanks in advance

If you're looking for a firmer pedal, you'd probably be better off investigating fitting the GT3 master cylinder rather than a big brake kit. 

 

It's a popular mod and relatively inexpensive if you get the TRW part (PMN116) - there's a thread about prices here: 

 

 

On stopping distances, are you finding that you're triggering the ABS? Big brake kits are generally designed for track work to deal with the heat issues associated with repeated hard use (though very long apline descents can also cause this). Tyre grip is likely to be the limiting factor for stopping distances as long as you're able to brake hard enough to trigger the ABS. If you can't, there's something wrong with the brakes.

 

The 987 is already one of 'The 50 best-braking cars in the world' according to Brembo (chart below), and you might find that a big brake kit doesn't achieve what you want it to. That being said, if you're dead set on bigger rotors, Girodisc are popular for track work and work with the original calipers I believe so don't cost as much as a full big brake kit would.

 

1%20ENG.jpg

Edited by wtaite01
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Liongolfer said:

Have read a few threads on this but looking for updated long term use feedback as well.

I'm thinking of upgrading the stock brakes on my 987.2S. What options are available? I'm on the BBS SR rims as well so I'll need to figure if the rims can take the bigger disc and caliper configuration.

Stock brakes are definitely not bad but for the occasional E braking, I do find them a tad soft so something firmer and a tad quicker to stop will give a confident boost.

I don;t track.

Thanks in advance

 

Fresh fluid and the GT3 master cylinder will firm the pedal up greatly.  If you can lock up the wheels/engage the ABS, your brakes already have more stopping power than your tyres can provide.

 

What tyres are you running?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, wtaite01 said:

If you're looking for a firmer pedal, you'd probably be better off investigating fitting the GT3 master cylinder rather than a big brake kit. 

 

It's a popular mod and relatively inexpensive if you get the TRW part (PMN116) - there's a thread about prices here: 

 

 

On stopping distances, are you finding that you're triggering the ABS? Big brake kits are generally designed for track work to deal with the heat issues associated with repeated hard use (though very long apline descents can also cause this). Tyre grip is likely to be the limiting factor for stopping distances as long as you're able to brake hard enough to trigger the ABS. If you can't, there's something wrong with the brakes.

 

The 987 is already one of 'The 50 best-braking cars in the world' according to Brembo (chart below), and you might find that a big brake kit doesn't achieve what you want it to. That being said, if you're dead set on bigger rotors, Girodisc are popular for track work and work with the original calipers I believe so don't cost as much as a full big brake kit would.

 

1%20ENG.jpg

 

Thanks for this.  I have the GT3 MC... my mech can't get it to work LOL.  I'm gonna have him try again.

 

On braking, I'm finding it doesn't stop as quickly as I like and the pedal travel is more than I like.  Not extremely bad by any measure.  I've been on a BBK before on a much larger, heavier jazzed up A6 and it braked a lot better (feel wise) and pedal travel was a lot less IIRC.

 

I was involved in a bad accident a long while back in my 997 and I haven't quite gotten over that experience so I just want more confidence with my brake setup.  Im on Brembo discs and LowMet pads.

 

I'm reading up on the Girodisc.  I'm thinking only front but apart from looking weird, should the rears be changed accordingly as well from a balanced braking perspective?

Edited by Liongolfer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Aaron said:

 

Fresh fluid and the GT3 master cylinder will firm the pedal up greatly.  If you can lock up the wheels/engage the ABS, your brakes already have more stopping power than your tyres can provide.

 

What tyres are you running?

 

No locking of brakes.  Haven;t had that yet fortunately but have had a few incidents where I had to brake hard and fast. I'm on PSS front and PS2 rears.

 

GT3 MC is as per my comment above. Man... LOL.

 

Appreciate your chiming in.

Edited by Liongolfer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, Liongolfer said:

 

Thanks for this.  I have the GT3 MC... my mech can't get it to work LOL.  I'm gonna have him try again.

 

On braking, I'm finding it doesn't stop as quickly as I like and the pedal travel is more than I like.  Not extremely bad by any measure.  I've been on a BBK before on a much larger, heavier jazzed up A6 and it braked a lot better (feel wise) and pedal travel was a lot less IIRC.

 

I was involved in a bad accident a long while back in my 997 and I haven't quite gotten over that experience so I just want more confidence with my brake setup.  Im on Brembo discs and LowMet pads.

 

I'm reading up on the Girodisc.  I'm thinking only front but apart from looking weird, should the rears be changed accordingly as well from a balanced braking perspective?

I see, thanks for the background, I can understand your concerns a bit better now! 

 

Looks like shark werks (well respected US porsche tuner) have done a Brembo BBK with the GT3 MC here: https://www.sharkwerks.com/2011-cayman-r-with-brembo-brake-amp-gt3-master-upgrade

 

Guessing it's the BBK you can get at design 911 here: https://www.design911.co.uk/fu/prod143508/Brembo-GT-Big-Brake-Kit--Front--Porsche---Brake-Disc-Size--355x32_13_2/

 

Either way, I would try again with the GT3 MC, maybe with a new mechanic 😜

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Liongolfer said:

 

No locking of brakes.  Haven;t had that yet fortunately but have had a few incidents where I had to brake hard and fast. I'm on PSS front and PS2 rears.

 

GT3 MC is as per my comment above. Man... LOL.

 

Appreciate your chiming in.

 

If you're not engaging the ABS then you need to brake harder!  Sounds like you could benefit from practicing some emergency stops to dial yourself in.

 

Find a quiet area, use a marker to stop from 30mph and try to do it in as short a distance as possible.  Then go a bit faster and keep repeating until it's second nature.  The target is to brake as hard as possible, but not to engage the ABS.

 

I would suggest that you ditch the PS2, practice your emergency stops with fresh fluid (or GT3 MC if your mech can manage it) then revisit.

 

Solely bigger discs are a waste of money - they will only help with dissipating heat (helps a lot on track, not so much on the road).  The pad's contact surface area remains unchanged with larger discs and therefore stopping power remains unchanged.

 

This is all about eliminating the weakest point in the braking system, and the pressure displaced by your foot seems to be the first place to start from my perspective.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Aaron said:

 

If you're not engaging the ABS then you need to brake harder!  Sounds like you could benefit from practicing some emergency stops to dial yourself in.

 

Find a quiet area, use a marker to stop from 30mph and try to do it in as short a distance as possible.  Then go a bit faster and keep repeating until it's second nature.  The target is to brake as hard as possible, but not to engage the ABS.

 

I would suggest that you ditch the PS2, practice your emergency stops with fresh fluid (or GT3 MC if your mech can manage it) then revisit.

 

Solely bigger discs are a waste of money - they will only help with dissipating heat (helps a lot on track, not so much on the road).  The pad's contact surface area remains unchanged with larger discs and therefore stopping power remains unchanged.

 

This is all about eliminating the weakest point in the braking system, and the pressure displaced by your foot seems to be the first place to start from my perspective.

 

LOL.  Noted on the weakest link being my foot pressure.  Will also try the GT3 MC again.

 

Also noted on the bigger discs.  Never knew that.

 

Your comment on ditching the PS2.  Please share your thoughts behind this. I'm due for a change soon and unfortunately, on my shores getting the PS4S in 18s in 265/40 is still a challenge. They do bring in the 235 or 245/40/18s for the front. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, wtaite01 said:

I see, thanks for the background, I can understand your concerns a bit better now! 

 

Looks like shark werks (well respected US porsche tuner) have done a Brembo BBK with the GT3 MC here: https://www.sharkwerks.com/2011-cayman-r-with-brembo-brake-amp-gt3-master-upgrade

 

Guessing it's the BBK you can get at design 911 here: https://www.design911.co.uk/fu/prod143508/Brembo-GT-Big-Brake-Kit--Front--Porsche---Brake-Disc-Size--355x32_13_2/

 

Either way, I would try again with the GT3 MC, maybe with a new mechanic 😜

 

Holy crap... over 3000 quid for Brembo BBKs!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Liongolfer said:

 

Holy crap... over 3000 quid for Brembo BBKs!


Errrm... yes :) That was my reaction to seeing the prices too, but I appreciate that some people must be happy to pay that, so wanted to flag them to you.

One thing I would also say is that I often find the first 'brake' of the day to be pretty disconcerting, requiring a harder shove than expected, maybe just scrubbing rust off the rotors.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Liongolfer said:

 

LOL.  Noted on the weakest link being my foot pressure.  Will also try the GT3 MC again.

 

Also noted on the bigger discs.  Never knew that.

 

Your comment on ditching the PS2.  Please share your thoughts behind this. I'm due for a change soon and unfortunately, on my shores getting the PS4S in 18s in 265/40 is still a challenge. They do bring in the 235 or 245/40/18s for the front. 

 

On the tyres, I would recommend looking at the new Bridgestone Potenza Sport: https://www.tyrereviews.com/Tyre/Bridgestone/Potenza-Sport.htm which comes in the cayman's 18 inch sizes and have had very good reviews.

Failing that, for more day to day road use you might find that the regular Michelin PS4 (Non-S) fit the bill better (again, you can get these in 235 and 265 40 R18): https://www.tyrereviews.com/Tyre/Michelin/Pilot-Sport-4.htm

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Get your GT3 Master cylinder working before you do anything else is my humble advice. I fitted mine myself and whilst it was a bit of a faff to get it working properly, it transforms the driving experience, not just the brakes.

 

Tell your mechanis to bleed the brakes. The pedal may well be mushy, but then drive up the road and engage the abs a few times by stamping on the pedal hard.

 

Then rebleed and you should be good.

 

The ABS needs to be activated either by a diagnostic tool or by the manual method above. I was slightly sceptical, but it did actually work brilliantly.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, andygo said:

Get your GT3 Master cylinder working before you do anything else is my humble advice. I fitted mine myself and whilst it was a bit of a faff to get it working properly, it transforms the driving experience, not just the brakes.

 

Tell your mechanis to bleed the brakes. The pedal may well be mushy, but then drive up the road and engage the abs a few times by stamping on the pedal hard.

 

Then rebleed and you should be good.

 

The ABS needs to be activated either by a diagnostic tool or by the manual method above. I was slightly sceptical, but it did actually work brilliantly.

 

Thanks again.  I've screenshot this post of yours to share with my mech when it comes time.  Hopefully he can get the MC to work next time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/09/2021 at 19:29, Aaron said:

 

Solely bigger discs are a waste of money - they will only help with dissipating heat (helps a lot on track, not so much on the road).  The pad's contact surface area remains unchanged with larger discs and therefore stopping power remains unchanged.

 

Just on the bigger discs thing, they require spacers on the calipers and that places the pads further from the hub so that breaking force can be greater (maybe force isn't the best word, torque maybe?).  At least that's how I understand the physics of it.

Edited by Andyoz
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have been toying with the idea of upgrading my brakes, mainly because I'd like to track the R a bit.

 

But TBH it's really a B road car for me and I have had slight brake fade on hard/deserted runs but I actually use it as a signal for me to cop on and slow the fook down a bit.

 

I think I'll get a £5k MX5 track car as well and beat on that.

Edited by Andyoz
Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, andygo said:

Read this thread for details on fitting the master cylinder:

 

 

 

 

Thanks. I did and forwarded it to my mech.  He still couldn't get it to work lol

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Liongolfer said:

 

Thanks. I did and forwarded it to my mech.  He still couldn't get it to work lol

 

He's clearly not a mechanic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

55 minutes ago, Liongolfer said:

 

LOL.  is there any way to test if the part is defective?

It's probably him being a bit thick. I'm not sure if that's classed as him being defective or merely substandard. I think he has already been tested by the well proven 'bleed my brakes' intelligence test and has failed.

 

Maybe try a different garage with better performing people.

 

(On a seperate note, I have never heard of a defective new master cylinder, the manufacturers tend to be quite careful about that sort of thing, something to do with safety I think...  :)  )

Edited by andygo
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.