Bore Scoring & IMS Failing

[FLAT STICK]

Hi All,

 

As it seems we are getting new members and people interested in buying Caymans, the same questions keep arising.

 

I don't know how to put a poll on, but as we probably own the majority of Caymans in the UK, how many of us have actually had problems with bore scoring or IMS failing and not the dreaded internet horror stories.

 

I for one, until putting this post on, have not had any issues in that department.  I've had a new water pump, window mechanisms, new brakes all round, exhaust studs snap, issues with rear window wiper and corroded coolant pipes.  The car has done 54k miles and I've owned it for 3 years this week.  It is serviced at Jasmine Porsche, all oil levels are frequently checked and premium Mobil 1 fully synthetic is used (although it doesn't use it).  The car is warmed up each time it is started.  I just thought it would be good to clear up some of what, I think, are myths that this is a regular occurrence which can put people off.  Bloggers have this as one of the first things they mention.  At the end of the day it is a 15 year old sports car.

 

Dean

[Mavrik]

@ FLAT STICK ...

 

To create a poll go to the main forum page    https://www.caymanoc.com/forums/   & there is a "create" tab... Click that & then Topic then choose the forum you want to post in then Continue then on the Create New Topic page click on Poll... Simples 😄

 

My CS has 63k miles on it & has had shocks inc top mounts, clutch & Fly, Water Pump & the usual brakes etc but touch wood, no other major issues (although my starter motor bearing is on its way out as it squarks a tad intermittently)

 

Mine does use quite a bit of oil (around 3/4 litre every 1000miles) & puffs a fair amount of smoke on start up for the first 10 secs or so but I'm not concerned as it runs sweet. Zero smoke once warmed up.

 

I'm considering doing the "bore scope" myself in the Summer with the widely available Endoscopes that one can buy  for attaching to a Smartphone(around £30 iirc)

 

The IMS on the my2006 onwards had a revised bearing & I believe their failure rate is much lower than the earlier version...

 

All marques of vehicle have their own "achilles heel" but it does seem that the anecdotal reports you hear are a little over dramatised? 

 

Edited January 10, 2020 by Mavrik

[mike3105]

Mine was bore scoped last week before being sold. Has 99k miles and no sign of scoring whatsoever. Always been properly serviced, cared for, and warmed up.

[FLAT STICK]

Cheers for your replies. 

 

It shows that the horror stores are unfounded and may be lowering the value of our cars.  The only reason I brought the topic up is that I've been watching a lot of so called bloggers on YouTube and the majority of them say what a great car they are but mention bore scoring and IMS failure.  New people joining the forum are subsequently having worries that they maybe don't need to have.

 

Dean

[Craiglm68]

From another angle, I'm a member of 5 different Cayman related FB groups, some UK only, others international in nature...there are 3K+ members spread across them. As for how many members of these have directly posted about their own Cayman experiencing terminal bore score or IMS failure, or that of someone they know personally.......I would guestimate no morel than 20 posts over the space of about 18 months.....the % is pretty damn small, but seems to get an inordinate amount of press. 

[sevenfourate]

27 minutes ago, Craiglm68 said:

From another angle, I'm a member of 5 different Cayman related FB groups, some UK only, others international in nature...there are 3K+ members spread across them. As for how many members of these have directly posted about their own Cayman experiencing terminal bore score or IMS failure, or that of someone they know personally.......I would guestimate no morel than 20 posts over the space of about 18 months.....the % is pretty damn small, but seems to get an inordinate amount of press. 

Couldn’t agree more Craig. And if these low % rates of failure were referring to a part where replacement costs were; or a solution was ‘just a couple hundred pounds’ and a few hours at your favourite garage; it would pretty much be a non issue of consideration when buying.
 

But although the risk of suffering bore-score is low; the consequences (and costs) are extremely high. And with seemingly no cast-iron common denominator of oil used, mileage etc - that’s understandably enough to put many off.

 

With these cars (Especially early Gen1 3.4’s ?) getting older and sold with more mikes on as time passes; I don’t see the (rightful) amount of times the question gets asked lessening....

[Dougle_turbo]

1 hour ago, Craiglm68 said:

From another angle, I'm a member of 5 different Cayman related FB groups, some UK only, others international in nature...there are 3K+ members spread across them. As for how many members of these have directly posted about their own Cayman experiencing terminal bore score or IMS failure, or that of someone they know personally.......I would guestimate no morel than 20 posts over the space of about 18 months.....the % is pretty damn small, but seems to get an inordinate amount of press. 

People like to share bad news, or give warnings - even when they have no direct evidence. People are thick.

[Ben]

Some sound advice above!  I have to admit that the (however small) potential for bore score (or IMS failure) was enough of risk for me at the time of buying my Cayman to rule out an S in favour of the 2.7, however the higher running costs (tax, insurance etc)  were also a consideration!   

The scare stories are of course not just about the Cayman but all the models with the larger capacity M96/97 engines, which creates a lot of over inflated noise on the internet - as ever, you only ever hear about the ones that go wrong, not all those that are working perfectly!

If I was in the market for an S today, I would carry out due diligence (borescope, professional inspection, history etc), but I would also make sure that if the worst happened I had a plan (and enough money) to resolve it to my advantage, i.e. a Hartech rebuild (oversized 3.9 perhaps?!), or maybe drop in one of those LS3 V8 engines!! 😁

 

https://www.hartech.org/oversized-engines

 

 

 

[phil27]

Probably tempting fate especially as it’s off for a major service in a couple of weeks but mine has been fine so far it’s on 73k and runs perfectly doesn’t use oil and been very reliable in the two and a bit years I have owned it. Oil has been changed frequently and let it warm up properly. 

[Markp]

I have just bought a late 2007 cayman S with 70k miles mint condition with a wad of paperwork about 2 inches thick from a Porsche main dealer. I wasn’t expecting a new car for its age but it looks clean enough and with only one owner I think it’s been cared for.  I joined a couple of the Facebook pages and instantly thought oh dear I’ve made a massive mistake buying one of these hence why I joined the cayman owners club and am here now, reading everyone’s post’s on here is giving me a bit of confidence back and I’m hoping mine proves to be ok if not I’ll just have to deal with whatever it throws at me, suppose it’s a bit like having a supermodel girlfriend you would put up with a certain amount of hassle for the looks haha.

[sevenfourate]

1 hour ago, Markp said:

I have just bought a late 2007 cayman S with 70k miles mint condition with a wad of paperwork about 2 inches thick from a Porsche main dealer. I wasn’t expecting a new car for its age but it looks clean enough and with only one owner I think it’s been cared for.  I joined a couple of the Facebook pages and instantly thought oh dear I’ve made a massive mistake buying one of these hence why I joined the cayman owners club and am here now, reading everyone’s post’s on here is giving me a bit of confidence back and I’m hoping mine proves to be ok if not I’ll just have to deal with whatever it throws at me, suppose it’s a bit like having a supermodel girlfriend you would put up with a certain amount of hassle for the looks haha.

 

Huge congrats and welcome aboard Mark. Looks Stunning ! Is that Seal or Meteor Grey ?

 

Yes there have been failures on both. But the percentages are very low. Surely you must have some warranty from a main dealer ? Is a bore scope inspection part of the pre-selling checks.......?

[Markp]

Meteor grey I think 

the dealer hasn’t mentioned a bore scope inspection and I wasn’t aware of the issue until after I bought the car I did however extend the warranty to six months. I will sit and go through all the paperwork and history and see if I can find anything.

[sevenfourate]

11 minutes ago, Markp said:

Meteor grey I think 

the dealer hasn’t mentioned a bore scope inspection and I wasn’t aware of the issue until after I bought the car I did however extend the warranty to six months. I will sit and go through all the paperwork and history and see if I can find anything.

 

Welcome to the Meteor Grey 'sub-chapter' too in that case 😂

 

 

Would be interesting to know if your car had a bore inspection done as part of the dealers presumed pre-sales checks. You can still get it done independently for £125 - £150 i believe if it didn’t and you're at all concerned.......

Edited January 30, 2020 by sevenfourate

[jim]

On 12/01/2020 at 17:33, sevenfourate said:

Couldn’t agree more Craig. And if these low % rates of failure were referring to a part where replacement costs were; or a solution was ‘just a couple hundred pounds’ and a few hours at your favourite garage; it would pretty much be a non issue of consideration when buying.
 

But although the risk of suffering bore-score is low; the consequences (and costs) are extremely high. And with seemingly no cast-iron common denominator of oil used, mileage etc - that’s understandably enough to put many off.

 

With these cars (Especially early Gen1 3.4’s ?) getting older and sold with more mikes on as time passes; I don’t see the (rightful) amount of times the question gets asked lessening....

i actually agree with this

having had a bomb proof air cooled and a 996 that was not effected, I'm very wary of taking the plunge again, due to some horror stories that i read - i do find it quite scary, and just could not afford an engine failure if i take the plunge into Cayman/Boxster ownership